In this insightful episode, Ron Higgs reveals the first step to scaling any organization, and it’s not what you think!
Scott Ritzheimer
Hello, everybody. Hello and welcome. Welcome to the secrets of the high demand coach podcast where we redo that we reveal the secrets of high demand coaches so that you founders and leaders out there can lead freer and grow faster than ever before. I’m here with a dear friend and our guest today, Mr. Ron Higgs. Ron is one of our scale architects here at skill architects. And he just does phenomenal work with clients. I’m so excited to have him on to share his story and let you in on some of the secrets that he’s learned along the way. So Ron, thanks so much for being here. Why don’t we get started? Why don’t you tell us a little bit about about your story about who you are, how you got into coaching and why?
Ron Higgs
Well, thank you, Scott, I appreciate the opportunity to be on the show. And I only hope I can mirror your enthusiasm. So thank you for asking that question. So I started off in the military of a military guy, went to the Naval Academy spent the career in the Navy flying airplanes and doing program management and acquisition. When I got out, I wasn’t sure what I wanted to do. So I did what typical military guys do is we go and work for defense contractors. So I did that for a little bit, actually, for a long time. And I got to my point, I worked for a couple of small corporations. And I worked for a couple of large defense contractors. And in the middle of that, you know, I just thought something was missing. I got myself involved in a couple of startups. And I went in, it convinced me that I had to transferable skills to move on. So about five years ago, I decided to leave my corporate job and start off as a consultant. And I kind of jumped and built my parachute on the way down. So I started off doing some leadership consulting, started off doing what a lot of us do, like sort of getting consulting gigs, wherever we can. And one of the things that ended up pushing me towards more towards coaching was the fact that people would always come to me and asked me my, for my advice, no matter what, whether it was a corporate transition, whether it was something in leadership, which was my chosen area of expertise. But I had all these people just come in to ask me, Ron, what do you think about this? Why don’t you think about this, all of a sudden, I stepped back and went, Wait a minute, you know, I think that I’ve already been doing it. I’ve already been doing what I’m good at. And that is the coaching. And one of the things that really helped me was that because I asked one of my peers, what do you think I’m best? She goes, You’re phenomenal coach. I went? I don’t think she said yes, absolutely, really. And that’s what sort of guided me to what I’m doing the day.
Scott Ritzheimer
I love it. When you when you sit with Ron, for anyone who hasn’t had this chance yet, but I have we’ve we’ve even had a chance to have lunch together in in Arizona, and got the full tour and everything. But when you’re with Ron, it’s just the world’s okay, you know, like there’s even stuff going on, it really doesn’t matter. You’ve just got this way about you that, that, you know, I think folks just trust you right away. I know, for me, there’s just a sense of like, Hey, we’re good. Let’s get rockin and rollin. Which is a lot of fun. Now, you glossed over a fact that I happen to know about somewhere along this journey. And that was that you were a test pilot. And you were flying planes that nobody had flown before. Tell us just a little bit about your time doing that?
Ron Higgs
Well, not exactly. So I was a naval flight officer in the Navy. And one of the things I got to do is flight tests is sort of just doing things in airplanes that haven’t been done before. Airplanes are highly technical, and you know the speed at which technology moves, right. And then for the defense of our country and airplanes, we’re always adding new things to airplanes, new weapons systems, new sensor systems, all sorts of stuff. So when those things get added, some people have to sort of manage all the engineering of getting those things added to the airplane, and then going out and operating those things and or flying the airplane, you know, for the first time. So yeah, I got to do that. And then, in my civilian career, after the Navy, I worked for Boeing, and I did some developmental flight tests on an aircraft called the P eight, and got to do things on that airplane that had never been done before. And that is a variant of a commercial 737. So for example, 730 sevens don’t have weapons. Right? So we mounted some weapons, pylons and missiles and bombs and things to that airplane. So I got to drop the first missile off the wing of commercial variant 737. So that’s stuff like that.
Scott Ritzheimer
Yeah. what a what a bunch of fun. Well, excellent. So tell us a little bit now you’ve gotten the work in the military, you’ve had work in the private sector, and you feel this calling in and it’s just confirmed in multiple ways like hey, you should be a coach, right? Something you can do. So tell us a little bit about the work that you do for your clients and why it’s so important.
Ron Higgs
Well, for me, I started off you know, all of us have our journeys, right, our ups and downs in these journeys. And during my while I was a consultant I was approached and ended up finding a job as a CEO of a small company. I mean, I just fell into it, just by pure luck, right, and I went, Wow, I’m actually pretty good at this. And it’s because I’m a systems thinker. I’m a systems thinker. And I’m a generalist, right. So I understand looking at the big picture, making decisions that are good for the entire company as a whole. And I get, I really, that was the job for me. And unfortunately, I lost that job due to COVID COVID hit us all hard. So I got laid off, I had that job for a very short period of time that I knew it was something that I was good at and wanted to move forward. But so I rebranded myself as a fractional clo. So I’ve been doing fractional clo work for a while. And I think it’s important to help busy business owners, busy CEOs, presidents come in and give them a second in command, give them somebody to bounce ideas off, give them somebody to help run the company, so that they can go and do simple things like go on vacation, go away for a little while, and be confident that the company is going to run and not you know, own a fractional basis, so they not don’t have to pay somebody full time to do that. So that Lately though, I’ve been moving more from the fractional CFO piece to the coaching piece, so in other words, I tend to work better through folks and advising coaching, rather than going and jumping in it also gives me the ability to service more clients, if I do that as a coach rather than a fractional CFO.
Scott Ritzheimer
Yeah. Now, when you’re sitting down and working with a, you know, founder or leader, and you’re going through your coaching process, what is it that you tend to do when you’re working with them? What problems are you you helping them face? What stages are you working in?
Ron Higgs
Well, as you know, every engagement is unique, right? But I look for in a predictable success world. I look for companies and Whitewater. Like we like probably a lot of us do, right? Because you know, all of those signs, particularly though I really like I one of the warning signs for me is somebody who doesn’t have an org chart. I say, Do you have an org chart? They say no, I go yes. Right. Because this is where I shine. This is one of the things I really like to do. Now, my background in the military, all the years I spent the military, military academy structure, organization charts, those things come naturally to me. So when I go someplace where there isn’t one I can do, what is right, and then my brain immediately goes to Okay, let’s set one up. And I got to be good at that. Now predictable success has really helped me set that up looking through the lens of Vox and the profiles of everyone, right visionaries, operators, processors, senators, right? And looking at that. First, let’s set up this notion or chart as to what we want it to look like and then get the right people in the right seats. And obviously, you know, VOBs based on that stage is really important. Like looking at this, like, Hey, you got a bunch of visionaries here. I see your problem. Right. You got too many processors here. I see your problem. You know what I mean? So that’s really the piece, lightwater and organizational charts and then also to the lateral management and cross functionality pieces do I realize those are
Scott Ritzheimer
the three there’s there’s so much in there that I want to I want to unpack so the first one is what I think a lot of people don’t realize, even if they know what Whitewater is, you know, it’s that time you’ve had success, but now all of a sudden, the levers of success don’t seem to work quite like they did before. Maybe it profitability is dropping, you’re messing up jobs, whatever it may be, but there’s just you’re systematically screwing up, right? Not anything that anyone wants to admit to, but something that every successful leader goes through. So you’re in the midst of this, and it feels like we’ve got to fix that thing. Right. Either we’ve messed up invoicing, we have to go fix invoicing, or, you know, sales are down, we’ve got to go drive sales more, but you and I know that that’s not the first step. Right. So the first step in getting out of Whitewater is actually to work on your org chart, which sounds about like the most boring thing in the world. If you think that an org chart is like a flowchart that, you know, you’ve got buried somewhere in your business plan from eight years ago. So why is it you know, in the work that you’ve done with your clients, why is it been so important to deal with that org chart first and what’s the result of that?
Ron Higgs
Well, just so you you know, this right, it’s because it really showcases and makes people understand where the decisions are being made. Right? Decision making is key right? Because we’re working towards that high quality team based decision making piece right because you know, in fun Hey, decisions made quickly implemented quickly or Right now you move into Whitewater, your leadership team making decisions quickly. But the organization not able to implement those decisions as fast as they would like, or maybe not able to implement them at all. And I had I had a situation where, again, same thing, hey, we decided to move over to Asana about a year and a half ago. Why didn’t that you know why or why haven’t we done that yet? And, you know, well, who’s in charge of it? That’s what I got. Right? Who’s in charge of it? What was the timeline? Right. Do you know what I mean? Have you any weekly report? So I mean, just, you know, just something as simple as God. Okay, well, you’re in charge of it. It’s due at the end of July. And I need weekly progress reports. And he quit. And let me and I also meet, tell me what you need to get that done. Oh, all of a sudden, that happened. Right. But again, the org chart was, again, let’s look at the org chart and figure out who’s responsible for it, who’s, again, you know, that helps with all the decisions. And were all you know, the right person to make that decision. And again, empowering people in flow into decision making down to the lowest level possible. So that’s what the org chart allows you to do. And
Scott Ritzheimer
I love that. I love that now, in your opinion, who, who needs to like, okay, org charts, front and center, right? Because every business leader out there saying, I’ve got 1000 things that I’m going up, right, there’s opportunities, there’s fires, there’s the whole gamut. And you want me to stop and work on an org chart? Who would you say? Is the person that you would you would answer? Yes, like an org chart is what you need. And and I’d probably recommend you going out and getting help to do it.
Ron Higgs
You mean, who specifically other than me?
Scott Ritzheimer
Who would be sitting out there listening right now saying, Oh, they’re thinking, do I need an org chart? How would you answer that?
Ron Higgs
Well, do you have one? Right? I mean, really? All right, who’s responsible for what are you having trouble? I mean, to some of the typical whitewater signs, are you stumbling places? Are you having trouble making decisions? Again, think about a decision that was made and you’re still waiting for something to happen? How long have you been waiting for this particular thing to happen? And then think about this, the human beings that you have in the organization, when that organization is small, those roles tend to be defined by the capabilities of that human being, as the company grows, right? You have to start defining the roles specifically, what do we need our director of marketing to do? Because right now, Mikey is our Director of Marketing. He’s our engineer, he’s the janitor, and he’s also the guy that goes to get lunch, right? When the company grows up, right? We can’t keep doing things that way. So if you have people like that, right, and if you have a whole bunch of things that are languishing and not getting done, then it may be time to really make it clear as to roles and responsibilities. That’s where the org chart comes in.
Scott Ritzheimer
it’s really profound. Because I think most folks would come in and say, we’ve got an accountability problem, right? Or we’ve got a an individual capacity problem, like that leader is just out of their league, right? They haven’t grown with the organization. And I think what you’re saying is sure, those things may be part of the problem. But the fundamental underlying thing is you’re gonna continue having those problems until you do the work of clarifying who does what, who’s responsible for what and when.
Ron Higgs
Absolutely. And it’s hard, because, again, you have some people who have been key to the organization up to this point, right. But if they, you have to start looking at once you do that org chart, and you’ve got director levels, manager levels, whatever. Now you have to look at, okay, what does the organization as a whole, what does the enterprise need this person to do? Right, what does the enterprise need this person to do it an example of this is I was working with an organization that said, Hey, we had somebody in the director position, but this person isn’t good with people. So we don’t give them any people management responsibility. Okay, well, listen, if you’re a director, that sort of implies that not only are you a people manager, but you’re likely managing managers, right? Because that sits at least a, you know, a second level position, right? So how can you have a title of director and not have any people management responsibilities? So when we write when we rewrite that title, the roles and responsibilities for that specific job that has to include people management responsibilities, so I’m sorry, that person is not able to perform that function for the good of the enterprise. Now, what do we need to do we either need to find someplace where they will be able to contribute or get them the tools that they need to become people managers.
Scott Ritzheimer
Yeah. Yeah. Such a big deal. Alright, so no, we’ve all been waiting for. I know I’ve been waiting for it. I know our audiences too. But what would you say is the biggest secret that you want to share like that that best piece of advice that you would give to someone that founder leader in an organization trying to grow, but they feel like they’re there. They feel like they’re stuck in that whitewater period and just don’t know the way out.
Ron Higgs
You know, this may sound simple but an outside perspective, I, I sell my services or I talk about myself and go, Listen, I can provide you with a dispassionate view in your company. Right, I can just come in from the outside and look, and I think anybody can come in from the outside and just take a look at what the problems are. Because sometimes if you’re in a forest, you can’t see the trees, right. That’s one of those things. And I think one of the biggest things someone like me, or anyone else can offer you is that outside perspective, and maybe looking at things the way you hadn’t thought about looking at it before, I tell you what, I have a best friend who’s a CEO of a company, right? Very successful company doing defense contracts. And when I talked to him, he looks at me and he goes, Man, every time I talk to you, right, you provide me with a perspective that I had not considered, right, because I’m looking in from the outside. And this is from this is from my buddy, a guy who I’ve done for 40 years. Right? So if he can, if I can help him see things differently, I think I gotta help anybody.
Scott Ritzheimer
Yeah, I love that. All right. So I have an opportunity to work with lots of coaches. And I know that one of the challenges that coaches have is that they spend all their best time and energy helping their clients. But sometimes, maybe oftentimes, they do that at the expensive, expensive working on their own business and growing themselves as leaders. So I want you to take your coaching hat off for a minute, I want you to put your CEO hat on. Ron Haig, CEO of wolf management solutions, and I want you to share with us for a minute what the next phase of growth looks like for you and your business, and what are you doing to achieve it?
Ron Higgs
Well, I tell you what, I have decided with the help of predictable success, right? That fun is good for me, right? I do not I don’t have any desire to build a company and go into this predictable success stage where I’m scaling or anything like that. Farm is perfectly fun, a great place to be. Now demand as things grow, as demand grows, again, start switching things up. So for me, as as a fractional CFO, I can only be so many places at a time and provide help for so many people. As I transition though, from being more of a fractional clo to a coach, then I can serve more clients. Now again, if there’s an increasing demand, there’s other things to do right niche, as you and I discussed in another conversation, you know, I’m working on a niche now that niche of organizations A, you need some organizational development, you need an org chart, I can help you because I really like doing this. Now, I’m also looking to give back to the African American community. So I would love to work with African American business owners and entrepreneurs. So I have a colleague who’s working on a book called niche down until it hurts, right? And I’m doing that I’ve actually said no, already to a couple of opportunities, because I’m looking to have opportunity, more opportunity in that niche. So that’s what growth looks like for me.
Scott Ritzheimer
I love that. And it’s it’s stunning, how, again, how painful niching down is, but how liberating it is on the back end of that. And and one of the things that I think a lot of folks don’t realize is that oftentimes Whitewater is the function of saying yes to too many things, right. And for those who either want to get out of whitewater and get into predictable success, or even those who want to pull back from whitewater into fun, the best way to do that is by starting to say no to something right. And fortunately, you know, you’re talking about a successful organization you’re talking about, you know, someone like you who’s who’s, you know, got something behind you got some wind in your sails. It’s a lot easier to do later on, right? But it’s something that we just don’t really think about once we kind of strike gold we run with a vein. But there’s a time where you have to come back and say hey, are these really people I want to work with? Is this really work that I want to do right? Is this really the best use of my time and I love that you’re
Ron Higgs
absolutely pause learning to say no is key and it’s hard sometimes to but it leads you in the right direction and the function of fun is almost saying yes to everything right and fun and then you injures you end up in Whitewater having said yes to any everything and it’s tough to go through that exercise and figure out okay, what is it that we’re doing really, really well? What is it that we’re doing well, and whatever it is that we’re doing not so well? Well, maybe we should stop this because nobody really wants to start removing services. But my I like to keep people in their zones of genius, right? So if you look at your products and service, this isn’t going okay, hey, is this in our zone of genius? Or if this in our zone of okay? Right? And the more work you do in the in your zone of genius, the better for everyone right, the better for you to better for your clients and everything else.
Scott Ritzheimer
Yeah. So, Ron to this. I don’t know if everyone caught it. But Ron said, I love that in reference to making an org chart. So I don’t know very many people in the world who would say I love making org charts. So if we’ve got this, again, it’s the first step, you’re in Whitewater to first step in getting out and you’re looking at a guy here, you’re listening on a podcast to someone who actually genuinely loves it is really, really good at so if you’re saying, hey, yes, I don’t have an org chart. Yes, we’re dropping the ball on implementation. And yes, we’d love to find out how to work with you, Ron, how do folks find you?
Ron Higgs
On LinkedIn? I’m a big proponent of the LinkedIn, find me on LinkedIn. I’m easy, Ron Higgs. I’ll say that’s it. You know, I have a website that I’m working on. www dot wealth management solutions.com. Work in progress. But for right now, LinkedIn is the best place to find me. And it’s
Scott Ritzheimer
fantastic. And it’s one of our scale architects. You can also find Ron on the scale architects website in the directory. So if you happen to be there, check them out, say hello. He’s going to be not only a great resource for your company, but just a tremendous asset for you personally, I know you’ll love working with them. Again, Ron Higgs scale architect and CEO of wealth management solutions. Ron, thank you so much for being here.
Ron Higgs
Thank you, Scott, for having me. It’s been great. Great to see you as always.
Scott Ritzheimer
Awesome. Awesome. And for everyone listening or watching today. Thank you so much. I love having you here. Remember that that outside perspective, right? It’s that one thing that can unlock success. It could be the one thing between you and the breakthrough that you’re looking for. It’s just that simple outside perspective, and you find it and you’ll find a great deal of success. Thank you so much for being here. I can’t wait to see you next week. Take care.
Contact Ron
Ron Higgs is a veteran, engineer, business executive, and published author. He has more than 20 years of experience in leadership, operations, engineering management, and program management. He has worked in several industries and held leadership positions in startups, small companies, and large corporations. He is a technically adept systems thinker who inspires collaboration, leads change, and creates synergy across all business operating functions.
Ron is the founder of Wolf Management Solutions, where he is a Fractional COO, consultant, and coach. He is a certified Scale Architect and Predictable Success expert where he helps busy CEOs scale their companies through leadership, organizational development, and process improvement.
Want to learn more about Ron and his work? You can connect with him right now at https://www.linkedin.com/in/ron-higgs/.